Thursday, September 26, 2013
British Museum Exhibition - Topic 3
There is much controversy over whether or not we should continue excavating at Pompeii, Herculaneum or both. What is your opinion on the issue, and how would you go about convincing world leaders (and museum officials/archaeologists) that your opinion is the right one?
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I believe that excavation of both Pompeii and Herculaneum should be continued. While there are risks to excavation, like the destruction of artifacts that stil lay buried, there is still so much we can learn from Pompeii and Herculaneum. A 4th of Pompeii still has not been excavated, and 3/4s of Herculaneum has not been seen by people alive today. If we leave those cities buried, we will never get to see the buried objects under the hardened ash. Think about all the people who died during the eruption. We have created stories for some of them, like the soldier on the beach in Herculaneum who took a belt and sword with him, because he thought that was the most important thing to take. I believe we should strive to create stories for as many people as possible. If we excavate, there is some risk that objects may be damaged. If we don't, there's a 100 percent guarantee that we won't see those objects.
ReplyDeleteI did not even realize the possibility of not finding the artifacts we do not look for now. This is very true, and it is a very good reason to continue to excavate both Pompeii and Herculaneum because the artifacts and stories can only hold up for so long.
DeleteI disagree, I think waiting until we can almost guarantee not damaging the artifacts would be a better choice. Preserving the items should be the number one priority and we should not rush, risking harming them, when they could just as easily be excavated at a later date.
DeleteThis is a pretty good point- we get so much insight into their lives because it looks like the city was frozen in an exact moment. It's a beautiful opportunity to find out as much about the average ancient Roman city as possible.
DeleteThinking about not excavating Pompeii and Herculaneum and not knowing what could lie underneath is a weird thought. I agree that we will never see most of all Pompeii and Herculaneum if we do not excavate them both.
DeleteI really like the points you made in your argument for excavating the cities, because you stated how much of these cities is yet to be discovered. Why would we not excavate the cities which will only benefit us?
DeleteAlthough you make several good points, a large problem is that Herculaneum is covered by modern day cities; excavating further would force us to tear up current buildings and possibly evict people from their homes. Historians are at a complex issue: do they tear up todays cities to discover yesterdays? Or do they leave those cities for future generations of historians?
DeleteThe excavation of Pompeii and Herculaneum is a bit of an awkward task. On the one hand it would be great if we could see what else has been saved for over one thousand years, but on the other hand we would have to take much more money and a lot of time. We should excavate, because the more artifacts we have, the more knowledge we will have of the Roman times. Some of the people in the video explain that it would not leave artifacts for future generations to study. I don't think that is a good idea, because they will have so much more to study there has been plenty of archaeological sites of past civilizations that we have not studied yet, they will have plenty of places to dig. Another argument was that we need to study what we have, but this argument does not make sense either. If we find more artifacts to compare to the ones we have, or better yet writings about the things we have, we will have an even better understanding of what we have found. The more artifacts, the overall better understanding.
ReplyDeleteThis is true Jordan but you never really know what we could find. Not even half of the cities have been excavated and maybe money and time is really worth the risk. But I do agree with the second half of your argument that we need to study what we have and we could always compare more pieces.
DeleteWe also don't know where these cities are; you say that they can study places we haven't, but what if there aren't any? Eventually there will be no more ancient civilizations. If you look at it from the point that there will always be more, you're taking a big bet in assuming there will be.
DeleteKristen brings up a good point. The fact is that Pompeii and Herculaneum are one of the best preserved ancient cities ever excavated. But other civilizations may not be as well preserved and may not give us as much information about the cultures of those civilizations. That is why I think we should stop and analyze what we have already dug up to make sure we understand as much as we can about these ancient cultures before we dig up more.
DeleteChoosing whether to excavate Pompeii and Herculaneum is a major conflict for art historians today. Should the artifacts be unearthed, at the risk of being damaged, or left safe in their underground havens? Personally, I think that excavation should continue, but slowly. Yes, there is some risk of damage, but what is the point of keeping the objects safe underground if nobody can learn from them? Art history is all about learning about cultures through art, so from that perspective, I definitely say the hunt for knowledge to continue. I do not claim to be an archeologist, however, so their views would probably be different from mine. So, I think the excavation should continue, but only at a pace where art historians and archeologists can adequately glean information from their discoveries. If some things have to be left for future generations because there just isn't enough time to study it, that's fine, but I don't think we should just ignore these objects arbitrarily.
ReplyDeleteI like how you provide a solution to the problem instead of just picking a side and defending your side. :)
DeleteThis is definitely the best way to continue excavation of both Pompeii and Herculaneum. At a pace that will be with the lowest risks of harming the artifacts, though enough for people to continue to gain knowledge.
DeleteI definitely agree. As long as the artifacts are handled and stored carefully, the excavation should continue at a slow pace.
DeleteI think you have the best solution, I too believe that we should "carefully" continue to uncover was it left of Pompeii and Herculaneum. Art is about discovering and exploiting risks. And like you said we can past down this information to the future generation so people over the would can keeping understanding what life was like during those time and learn more about other cultures.
DeleteSlowly, carefully, and all in moderation. I think it is very smart to take a balanced solution. People often get over excited and dive head first into what they are doing, but if we take the excavation process in slow, planned steps we can learn so much more.
DeleteI believe that the excavation of both Pompeii and Herculaneum must continue. Although money is a problem, excavations costing millions of dollars to recover, it does bring great information and educates the public about what life was like during AD 79, when the eruption of Mount Vesuvius took place. What many museum officials and archaeologists should and probably do know is that leaving the unknown artifacts uncover can led to major conservation problems. The open exposure of the light, plants, and animals could cause serious damage to the artifacts and may never be recovered again. Things like vandalism and theft could take place too, if art historians don't continue the excavation. I believe that by continuing we may find important items that can help solve may questions and solve problems in our world today. I don't think I'm being unrealistic but I know this is going to take some serious time and effort and an immense patience. I'm not saying we should dig everything and everywhere out now and call it a day but take it with caution and trial and error. Archaeologists should focus on one area of land to rediscover then when finished excavating, research other, that way the projects are done faster and finding unknown artifacts would (hopefully) be easier.
ReplyDeleteI agree with your point that it is not necessary to dig up everything, but excavating the cities will answer many questions that art historians have. I like how you essentially created a middle ground for archeologists who want to excavate and those who do not.
DeleteI agree with you completely. By digging up just one portion of the city, we can ensure that the artifacts are safely uncovered and persevered but also find out more information about the culture of these two cities. This is a great middle ground for the two opposing sides.
DeleteAs the experts in the movie said, I think we should wait and just go through and analyze the items that we have already excavated instead of continuing to dig up more of the city. Although the idea of uncovering everything in Pompeii and in Herculaneum would be fantastic, it’s just not feasible to do it. The cost to uncover the rest of the city is extremely expensive and we already have a lot of uncovered items that we have not thoroughly analyzed. Also by not digging now, we can ensure the preservation of newly excavated items, once the technology is better to preserve these ancient items. So by waiting to dig up the rest of these cities, we can ensure the survival of the artifacts that give us so much insight in to the lives of the people of Pompeii and Herculaneum.
ReplyDeleteI see your point on the expenses and waiting for better technology. However, I think that if we had more artifacts it would make analyzing the artifacts easier. We may uncover an item that is similar to another item, and we could use that to help distinguish their uses. We may even find writing that would enhance even more our knowledge of these artifacts.
DeleteI like your point about waiting for better technology, but we have no guarantee that the artifacts still buried will be in recognizable shape in, say, the next decade or so. And some places may need be excavated before they are paved or built over.
DeleteWell, why can't we do both? Excavate the rest of Pompeii and Herculaneum, and study the artifacts we have now? Excavating only paints a bigger and clearer picture of their cultures, while adding to the pieces we have now. It is like a jigsaw puzzle.
Deleteyes, I agree with your stance. The cost is crazy expensive and we have ample artifacts already uncovered that historians can analyze and devote their time to. We need to slow it down a bit and calm our horses.
DeleteAlthough I do like your point about wanting to preserve the pieces, don't you think that even though it would be really expensive to excavate the cities, the cost would not be that big of a deal because archaeologists would be able to uncover pieces from this culture that could provide answers to the mysteries of the cities?
DeleteThis is a valid point but time is not what we need. We need to uncover the items before we might loose them for forever. and I agree with Ilyse that finding new pieces will answer the many questions we have of the cities artifacts.
DeleteI believe Pompeii and Herculaneum should be preserved at this point and that all excavation should stop. Shouldn't we cherish what knowledge we've uncovered up to this point? If we bite off more than we can chew, we run the risk of destroying and disturbing uncovered bodies and artifacts. Since we already have ample insight into the life of the Pompeiians, I think excavators should take their skills elsewhere and spend money on other knowledge-filled and unknown cities and ancient ruins.
ReplyDeleteI see your point, but we our a Western Society. Our most fundamental point, the foundation of our culture can be found in the Roman times. Herculaneum and Pompeii are the windows in to our culture and civilization's past. When we excavate these sites we are not only studying history, but we are studying our cultures history. Personally i would want to know everything possible about our culture and its history.
DeleteI understand your opinion, but I would want to be able to be dug up along with artifacts from my time and show that I was part of a unique part of a society. There is no such thing as too much learning and educating one selves self about other people and how we all connect. We should try to get as much information on Pompeii and Herculaneum as we can and spend money wisely on sites we are already familiar with.
DeleteBarrett, your last sentence implies other unknown cities and ruins should be excavated, but for the most part, how is that debate any different from Pompeii's? There could still be artifacts, dead bodies, buildings, history, all waiting just beneath the surface, and that goes for any archaeological site-including Pompeii. I just think that if you're going to say nay on the excavation, perhaps some consistency would help me to sympathize with your viewpoint.
DeleteThe excavation of both Pompeii and Herculaneum is a very tedious task and contains many risks. Though with so much more to learn, aren't the risks worth it? The artifacts that are still buried beneath the thousand year old rubble contains such rich knowledge about a world we only know so little about. It is true, it will be difficult, though isn't that always the case. Continuing the excavation of both Pompeii and Herculaneum will be nothing but beneficial to people all around the world. Do they not say that the best things come with a price? Well this is one that is definitely worth it.
ReplyDeleteYou make a good point about how, even if there are risks, it is better in the long run. Every excavation comes with risks, but think about all the wonderful art we have now that we wouldn't have had before!
Deleteeven though every excavation comes with risks, these risks in particular seem too high. The artifacts currently uncovered have clearly shown their capability of standing the test of time, so they will fend just fine if left untreated. Why do we need more from the city of Pompeii?
DeleteThe "risks" you are talking about are the possibilities that the artifacts could be ruined because we rushed into excavating them. I think slowing down would be the best for everyone before we run into serious problems that could have been avoided by just slowing down.
DeleteI do not say for the excavating to be "rushed" but at a tedious pace in which the risks will not be at harm to the artifacts, and if they think the risks are indeed too high, then no they should not. But I know they have ways of excavating these arts without bringing them much harm.
DeleteYou make a really good point on how the risks are an important thing to think about. But you are right, it is a good price to pay. If we do not go out and explore more of these places, we will never know all the great things these places had to offer.
DeleteYou make a really good point on how the risks are an important thing to think about. But you are right, it is a good price to pay. If we do not go out and explore more of these places, we will never know all the great things these places had to offer.
DeleteI think the excavation of Pompeii and Herculaneum should be stopped, but only for a period of time. We need to focus on the items already found, studying them and making sure they have a museum or safe place to be stored before digging up more. It is selfish to want more when we haven't fully appreciated what we already have. Also, like Dr Mary Beard said, we should leave some artifacts for future generations to find so they can experience the excitement of discovering new items, especially if they have new technology that can excavate the artifacts quicker and easier.
ReplyDeleteAlthough I do believe it is a great learning experience for the future generation to be able to experience the delight of excavating artifacts, I still think it's too big of a risk to let the art pieces sit around. We have had millions of people and thousands of cultures exist on Earth,therefore, I'm also sure that there are other artifacts across the world that they would be able to discover and able to recover in time.
DeleteI don't think we can just focus on the objects we have now. That's like trying to finish a puzzle but just staring at the picture you have now and trying to guess what it is. We need to continually add pieces, or the picture will never get any fuller.
DeleteFinding more artifacts will help us to study the ones we already have. Maybe we have found an odd object and we uncover a painting depicting the use of that object. Finding museums for these artifacts should not be hard if we have deals happening for exhibits and some museums fighting over such objects. The problem with leaving things for the future generations, in my opinion, is an odd argument. I mean sure they will not have the ability to find more things, but they will have the opportunity to study more things than we were ever able to.
DeleteI completely agree with you! Even though the majority of us students are advocates for unearthing new artifacts, I agree that it is selfish to be sitting at the edge of our seats waiting for more.
DeleteI agree with Jordans comment. The more artifacts we find, the more questions that we have about other pieces might be answer but more questions might appear. I think not excavating just because we want to keep looking at previous artifacts is a tad silly. Just being stuck on an object for years isnt going to help.
DeletePaige, I like the analogy you made with the puzzle! Excavation is useful to not only understand even more about the culture but to further make sense of what we already have.
DeleteThat is a good point. Though why not be selfish and put the whole puzzle together ourselves? We have been doing it for years and have been pretty well, so why not?
DeleteI don't really understand what you're saying. Why would it be selfish for us to find out things about Pompeii and Herculaneum? I don't really see anything wrong with finding more about these places. The more we find, the more we can really understand what these places were like, and we can learn a lot about history this way.
DeleteThis is a very controversial issue that I have definitely debated back and forth on. I have come to the conclusion that it can only be beneficial to excavate more pieces. Why would archaeologists and art historians not want to uncover pieces that could provide us with insight of a culture that lived thousands of years ago? Though people argue that we need to focus on the pieces we have already discovered, having more pieces can help confirm beliefs that art historians have since there may be more than one piece of the same object. Art historians can never be certain what certain pieces were used for or what they represent, so uncovering more pieces could be very helpful. Pompeii has become fascinating to many people, so I believe that excavating it will uncover the mysteries we are uncertain about. Our knowledge of Pompeii and Herculaneum would definitely become more defined.
ReplyDeleteI see how uncovering more of the cities of Pompeii and Herculaneum would help give more insight into the roman culture, but by uncovering too much of the city at once, we put the artifacts in danger of being overlooked or destroyed in the process. But both sides of the controversy have their benefits and drawbacks in terms of being able to gather more information on the culture and preserving the pieces that we may find.
DeleteSo much money and time has gone into excavating both of the cities, but is it really that necessary to stop excavating? Why wouldnt we want to find more amazing pieces like the ones we already have discovered. We have found so many artifacts telling his facts, customs, and effects that we would have never of found out about without these pieces. I also dont agree with multiple students arguments about how we should continue studying the artifacts we have now and delay excavating. We should not stop trying to uncover this city just to ponder and stare at the same pieces we have had for years. There may be more artifacts that can answer these questions we have yet to find.
ReplyDeleteExactly, Rachel! I especially like what you said about answering questions we don't even know yet! We know a lot about Pompeii and Roman cultures already, but there is so much we have left to learn, and excavating further will give us that opportunity.
DeleteBut it is necessary to study the pieces already found because why else we we bother to dig them up? Just to talk about how pretty they are? The point is to get as much information from each piece that we possibly can and having too many artifacts at once can distract us from focusing on pieces that could be important
DeleteYES! Why stop now? We know that there are so many unknown wonders of Pompeii, and franklyI do not think it is humanly possible to stop.
DeleteIt is really necessary to keep on continuing to find things. I really agree with you, there are so many questions we still have unanswered about these artifacts, and we will not be able to fully answer them without having more artifacts which we have not even found yet.
DeleteI think the excavation of both Pompeii and Herculaneum should definitely continue. I think it is important for us to find these artifacts, and take time to slowly decipher the meaning behind them. I understand why people believe we should not continue to excavate Pompeii and Herculaneum because we should spend time learning about the objects we have already found there. But I believe before we fully understand what the objects we have found from these places, and their true meanings, we need to search deeper to get more background and more information on these people's stories. If we do continue to excavate Pompeii and Herculaneum, it is vital we are very carefully as to not destroy any artifacts while we are finding new things. I think we should build some new technology making it easier to take out these artifacts from Pompeii and Herculaneum so we can be gentle with these objects.
ReplyDelete